Rent Control Rally Concert

“Save Rent Control” performance at Maxwell’s in Hoboken

To add yet another giblet to the whole Rent Control Debate in Hoboken – is a “Save Rent Control” concert over at Maxwell’s (11th & Washington) next week.

The performance takes place on Thursday, October 25th at 8pm.

Acts include: The Demolition String Band, Jamie & the Della Faves, The Benson Ridge Project, Karyn Kuhl and much more.

It was arranged by the Hoboken Fair Housing Association (who urges the public to vote “No” on election day to Public Question #2.)

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29 Comments on "Rent Control Rally Concert"


Member
2 years 10 months ago

HansBrix said, “No this is not the same thing a capping gas prices. It’s about helping to bring about fairness in bargaining relations where one party is significantly stronger than the other.”

It would be the same as putting price controls on gas. Where do you get capping from?

Businesspeople have something to sell (gas, milk, property usage).
Customers want to buy something they have (demand).
Government puts prices controls on rent, but not all others.

As (government neglect) inflation increases, where is the government on all the others? Would not price increases in all gas, milk, groceries, utilities, taxes, etc in town not also cause some to flee Hoboken, which undermines your social engineering goals?

Your notion that government intervenes to bring about bargaining relations in no way is fair, as the term is, not what you want the term to be. Fair is when two parties agree to price. Unfair is when one party doesn’t like the price, and instead of living in another unit, demand the government intervenes on their behalf at the cost (discount) of the owner. In no way is that fair. When someone signs a lease to property for one year, they’ve agreed to 1 year, but in reality stay forever, regardless of how many zeros are after their salary or children’s children’s salaries. Ironically, rent controlled units are for the most part inherited through generations of those who don’t even own the property. Funny.

Member
HansBrix
2 years 10 months ago

In a prior post I say…

“These are no so much price controls but protections against widespread abuses and predation than WILL happen in the absence of such laws.”

I guess you skipped over that part.

No this is not the same thing a capping gas prices. It’s about helping to bring about fairness in bargaining relations where one party is significantly stronger than the other. Maybe you see that as social engineering and if so I’m clearly pissing into the wind.

Member
2 years 10 months ago

HansBrix, read up on allodial and land patents. Only in a few countries can a person be an absolute owner. Texas, Nevada both have a much stronger version of it.

The rest of your response is an argument in support of social engineering. Unfortunately, it relies heavily on an appeal to emotion.

I wonder about your understanding of rent control, and am curious if it’s more of a political posture. Apartments in Hoboken are more plentiful than ever before, so where’s this scarcity? Even if Hoboken doubled it’s units, there’ll be more people who want (demand) to live there than spaces. Rent control isn’t affordable housing for only low income residents, since you’re well aware of high income residents living in rent control units. You know this, but still include that fallacious argument in your post. So what is rent control, if not merely government price controls?

Under your argument, why are there no price controls on gas? When rents go up, people move to more affordable units. But when gas and milk goes up, the poor are hurt more than anyone else since these are essentials. Where is the government to control these prices? Where is the government when inflation cause prices increases well above % moves of rental increases? What happens when people who work in Newark and live in Hoboken can no longer afford the gas for the commute and have to move to Newark, when rent remains the same? Where is the government when the government makes it harder for poor people to get by when everything costs more because the government effed up the world by doing the very thing of over reaching their authority as with rent control?

Member
HansBrix
2 years 10 months ago

“You do realize that’s not legally possible, right”

Ever hear of “zoning”? How about “eminent domain”? Your “sovereignty” means little when the govt has different ideas. We even learned not too long ago that your property can be taken so that a Walmart can go in (Kelo), or high end high rise condos can be constructed (Long Branch, nj). I don’t agree with those decisions but here we are.

So I don’t think you see RC as a public good, or recognise that RC rules rest on a time honored principle that public authorities may intervene in markets driven by scarcity to ensure fairness in bargaining relations. These are no so much price controls but protections against widespread abuses and predation than WILL happen in the absence of such laws.

What would happen if RC was scrapped? Eventually we’d see a forced exodus of a large portion middle and moderate income people and families. Where will they go? Who cares right? We’d see higher rental turnover as people see their rent shoot up by double digits as their pay stagnates and job market sputters. People who work in low paying but socially valuable professions will be forced to make hard choices. Double up? Commute from further out? Quit? Doesn’t matter so long as LLs can maximize their return!

But these people are society. And forcing them out will have a destabilizing effect on that society. You’ll end up with lots of rich, a layer of permanently poor welfare class, and little else. Who’s gonna run the shops with razor thin margins? Who will enforce parking, cut your hair, pour your Blue Moon, or look after Dakota and Hudson as you shuffle paper under flourescent lights in NYC? You’ve banished them to the hinterlands and they cant justify the time or costs of coming in to serve you.

Member
HansBrix
2 years 10 months ago

“Holding landlords responsibe for overcharging for rent in the past is insane. ”

Is any more or less sane then the prospect of losing your property due a defect in title, or an illegal conveyance in the past of which you were unaware? How about finding out that you are responsible for cleaning up that oil plume coming out of a leaking underground storage tank that some owner in 1940 installed?

RC didn’t sneak up on anyone. Anyone who buys a place where RC is on the books needs to perform an extra layer of due diligence if they want to make it a rental property. That’s all. If you think the laws are onerous then don’t buy. Simple. If you didn’t do your homework and want to have your mistake legislated away, or if you want to have long standing rules changed to increase your profits, how is that really different from traditional rent seeking behavior?

Member
shootyz23
2 years 10 months ago

Seems to me that the instances you mention are also insane, but the common thread among all is insanity……does this somehow make your point?

Agreed, due diligence is in fact the responsible thing if one wants to own rental property. But mistake, lack of due diligence or whatever you want to call it requiring a new property owner to pay for the sins of a previous owner is just wrong.

BTW, I rent. In fact, I support rent control and frankly I think this issue is full of shit. I just do not see too many of these rent controlled apts around. Though, admittedly I may just not be in the know so to speak. Where are these? Simonici quoted in the Reporter “landlords……getting $600 per month”. What apt in Hoboken is $600 a month?

Landlords not making enough? Really? Rents over 2k for a shithole apt…..Again, I just moved so I saw much of the rental stock….some of these “oppressed” landlords should be ashamed of themselves with how the properties are kept (including the common areas!)

That being said, still feel can’t hold new owners responsible in my eyes….[quote comment=”217636″]“Holding landlords responsibe for overcharging for rent in the past is insane. “Is any more or less sane then the prospect of losing your property due a defect in title, or an illegal conveyance in the past of which you were unaware? How about finding out that you are responsible for cleaning up that oil plume coming out of a leaking underground storage tank that some owner in 1940 installed?RC didn’t sneak up on anyone. Anyone who buys a place where RC is on the books needs to perform an extra layer of due diligence if they want to make it a rental property. That’s all. If you think the laws are onerous then don’t buy. Simple. If you didn’t do your homework and want to have your mistake legislated away, or if you want to have long standing rules changed to increase your profits, how is that really different from traditional rent seeking behavior?[/quote]